A shocking headline about SXSW’s music portion set the internet buzzing. Are big festivals on the decline, or are they simply evolving? Tune in as we break down the changes. In the Let’s Talk episode of Tech in the Arts, AMT Lab’s Podcaster Producer, Jinghong Gong, and Social Media Manager, Sofia Akhmanaeva, discuss the latest headlines.
Show Notes
Hollywood Reporter - “SXSW Clarifies Changes to 2026 Music Conference”
NPR - “So many music festivals have been canceled this year. What's going on?”
Transcript
Jinghong Gong
Welcome to Tech in the Arts, the podcast series hosted by the Arts Management and Technology Lab at Carnegie Mellon University. We keep you updated on the news and current developments in all things arts, tech, and media. My name is Jinghong Gong, and I'm the podcast producer here at AMT Lab. I'm joined today by Sofia.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
Hello, Jinghong. I'm Sofia Akhmanaeva. I am marketing manager at AMT Lab and Arts Management student at Carnegie Mellon University. And today we have some hot headlines from music industry and specifically from SXSW with their news about the cancellation of music part of the conference. And we're going to discuss this and some other partially exciting, partially concerning trends in festival industry in music.
Jinghong Gong
For sure.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
And Jinghong actually went to SXSW this year. Tell us more about this. How were your feelings about the news and about the atmosphere this year?
Jinghong Gong
So, very interesting thing that you brought up the headlines, exactly three days ago. It was one day after South by, and we just flew back from South by Southwest from Austin, and we saw this headline by the Hollywood Reporter. It says, “South by Southwest Music is No More”.
And at that time, a lot of my friends were sending me that because they saw me at South by, and they were saying, “Oh my God, there's no more music at South by Southwest. Like, what is happening?” We went into the report, and we saw, basically the organizer saying there's a decline. There's a huge decline in the attendance for the music part of the conference, and they are considering restructuring. But, very interestingly, two days later, they changed the headline. So, they just say it clarifies the changes. They changed that headline of saying there's no more music, because everyone was going crazy on all kinds of forums, talking about, “oh my God, there's no more music.” And South by historically is a music festival. So this is the exact same report, the one that you're looking right now. They had an old title of saying there's no more music.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
Okay. Yeah, I got it. Now I wonder if South by actually asked them to do so.
Jinghong Gong
I definitely think so.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
That's interesting. But if you actually read the article, it doesn't seem like music disappears at all. At least they try to obviously position it as it does not disappear and it just blends with all the film and tv programming, how do you see it? Like, how do you think it's gonna actually deemphasize the music or it's just gonna rebalance the festival programming in a better way?
Jinghong Gong
So my personal experience, coming back from South by, I think the main observation that I felt was — I went to all these music shows. I went to Rema. I went to all these big artist’s showcases, and the attendance was like, I was expecting, you know, just going into a super packed crowd - being squished. Exactly. But, it was very, kind of, chill. It was quite comfortable.
You know, me being in the music enthusiast and I go into all these shows, I would expect like a crazy crowd. But unfortunately, I don't know, I mean I had a good experience, not being in lines and do all those crowds, but I think the organizer and like South by themselves felt like, oh, we had these big artists come through. But they mentioned the ACL Live, a live house, which I believe it was a 2,500 capacity live house. And no, it wasn't packed out because of all these big artists. So, I think that was one of the main observations that it wasn't as crowded, like the music festival.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
I wonder why is it so. I mean, obviously, there is a complex of, there are several reasons for it probably, but I wonder if it's just because South By became industry events so much rather than showcase event or entertainment event.
Because I feel like the conference part of the music itself is not really very rich. Like it's mostly concerts, right?
Jinghong Gong
There's a good amount of music conference. My cohort and I, we arrived a little late. We arrived at the second half of the music conference, so we got to go to a few of the panels and conferences. But, compared to film and TV, I would say there's probably less. And also just from attendance wise, my friends who went the first half of the festival, who went for the film part, they were saying towards the end of the film part of the festival, the streets became empty. Like, the last two days of their festival. It was just like, the hotel prices dropped. Traffic was no more. And, they could feel like a decline in attendance, as it goes into the music weekend. I don't know if there's a resurgence. I felt like okay, there's a decent crowd, but I don't feel like it was too crowded or anything during the music part.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
I think it's a very illustrative example of what's going on with festivals in general over past, I wanted to say two years, but basically after the pandemic. There are several parts to it, and I think the oldest narrative would be probably like gentrification that festivals bring, and specifically South by, when like Austin, like locals from Austin kind of hate this event.
But the newer, newer trends include generational divide, basically. Right? Do you think it's connected to that? Like, hey, this is, the festivals used to be a millennial thing with all the booze and like partying and stuff, and Gen Zs are not really into that anymore.
Jinghong Gong
In a sense, like there's, in terms of like fan base, people are more attracted to the niche sound or the music taste is more narrow. I would say like, even personally, there's big artists like Benson Boone. I didn't know about him.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
Uh oh, really?
Jinghong Gong
Yeah, it was crazy because my music selection was very, catered towards another side, and his music just did not come through my channel of getting music. So, a lot of these festival goers, they only know a part of the artist that goes there. Might not even know every single headliner at the festival. So I think that can be an issue. And also as you bring up the locals, I know the locals hate it. Like when I was there, I felt bad for the locals because during the South by Southwest Music Weekend specifically, all the local venues, like every single one of them, were basically occupied by South by, and all the locals need to line up and they need to fill in a RSVP list and they need to pay covers while me being the festival goer, I paid for the badge and they can just scan my badge and I skip the line and go in.
You know, I feel like at times, when I went to some of the more local venues it just felt weird. I just felt like I invaded a space that they used to chill and hang and then now there's all these outsiders coming in, skipping a line and I felt like, I don't know, how is it affecting the local culture? I'm sure it's just a short because South by is just a week and a half. But I think the locals probably hate it and they avoided by all costs trying to not be around that area during that time.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
It seems like the whole trend in festivals just goes in reverse because there used to be a time — at least, I'm from Russia and I saw this trend in Russia — when more and more festivals started going broader in terms of the genre selection.
We had a huge jazz festival in Moscow for years, and at some point. It just stopped being a Jazz festival. They still were cool, but this selection of artists was everything like from pop to even electronic sometimes. And it feels like now it goes in reverse. People are less interested in this kind of “salad “ of things, but also they're less interested because it brings the whole number of disadvantages for local communities. And we discussed before recording that all electronic music festivals are probably doing fine.
Jinghong Gong
They were doing really well. I just went to one in Chicago last year.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
Yeah, exactly. And the same is probably true for Jazz festivals that keep some kind of loyalty to the genre in all its variety, but still. And probably folk music festivals or like any broader genre that is still kind of homogeneous seems to do fine.
And it seems to be the thing with particularly huge festivals. And the article that you sent, the podcast from NPR, the Indicator from Planet Money. The interesting thing that they discussed there was about the formative festivals as something that is tied to millennials and particularly older millennials, consumption habits basically, and I'm gonna quote right now, right?
Research suggests that actually "though Gen Z may be different, it finds that they drink less alcohol overall. They do fewer drugs, they have less sex and fewer partners, and they're lonelier." Will believes this generational change is reducing demand for music festivals and he points out, it's not just smartphones and social media.
What really touched me in this little paragraph is that it seems like the definition of the festival itself is an event for booze and crazy party and stuff, although it probably does not need to be. So, what do you think about it? Like is there any way to reimagine, reinvent, the format?
Jinghong Gong
I think there's definitely way, like from a health aspect, I think, you know, ideally not all youngsters are going to get on booze and cause all kinds of damage to their body. I think, they bring up millennials, but I also think a big thing they need to consider is that Covid took a big impact.
You know, the pandemic shut a lot of people in, the house for basically three years, that three years’ time spent, a lot of life events was not happening. Festivals were not in full attendance, and I think that affected kind of a generation of teenagers that don't really…
Sofia Akhmanaeva
They really skipped the whole socialization part.
Jinghong Gong
They skipped this part of life. I lived a year in Chicago and a lot of my friends in Chicago, they said, oh, they used to go to Lollapalooza during high school and they don't go to there anymore because that's a really high school thing to do. And if, you know, imagine that batch of high school student didn't really go to Lollapalooza, and then afterwards they're like, what is the charm of festival? Like, it will take more for them to actually go to a festival afterwards. without that, introduction of a group, festival experience during that stage of their life.
Even last mini, we were at Mr. Smalls Theater. We were talking with the owners there and they were also saying, they realize that teenagers are not really attuned to live events and they needed to host specifically like Taylor Swift Nights, just to bring them out and to let them experience, “Hey, this is how it feels being at a live event.”
And then they slowly, become more interested in trying to, look for live bands and live events at you know, live venues. and I feel like that applies, similarly to festivals as well.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
Yeah. So it seems like it's bigger trends. There are not really temporarily, but it's also some other trends that are temporarily just because of Covid still. Oh my God. It's 2025 and we're still talking about Covid because it's real.
Jinghong Gong
There’s lasting impact on entertainment industry for sure. Yeah. Another thing that I want to bring up, I think previously in the last Let's Talk we also talked about, you know, music streaming, and how it's affecting our listening habits.
I think that might have played an impact into, you know, I was saying that my music tastes, algorithm still dictates, how I discover music and, you know, if I rely on algorithm to get my music, the music I listen to is gonna be more homogenized.
They're going to feed things that are similar to what I previously listened to. And that's why some of the headliners that I didn't even know, which I felt really bad. But, at the same time, you know, compared to the previous ways of, many people listen to songs. they know about songs from radio.
And radio traditionally pushed a wider genre, of music. there's Beyonce, but then there's also country and also all these different types of genre that's being pushed through the radio channel. People know about those songs. People know about those hit songs across different genres.
And at a festival that is mass appealing. That's, you know, from that format, it's easier for, people to know every headliners and all the acts there, compared to now. People are more in tune with their niche of their listening, music taste. And it's harder for these mass appealing, broadband, advertising, appealing festivals to get their crowd.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
Comparatively the very focused, the very kind of attacking the niche market like EDM festivals are doing tremendous, you know, the EDC festivals, that serves one niche and there's the identity to it. They're doing really well. Yeah, I think it's all the same about this reverse trend going into niche, and it's so interesting how you would think maybe that technologists and all these algorithmic things and the variety of choice that you constantly just readily have in your phone would kind of widen your perspective, but now it's actually going the other way.
I wanted to go back to this thing about reinventing the format of the festivals because it seems really concerning, but also interesting that just by default festivals are viewed as this event where you just go to hang out and yeah for booze or like whatever, spend time with friends with music on the background. But this is it. Like, it seems like this is the unique selling proposition and nothing more and probably. And I'm just, I'm talking here like a visionary. I don't really have a plan. I worked in the festival industry, but yeah, obviously it's something for the future. Just us for the future, maybe it's time to reinvent the format in the sense of giving people more valuable and more thoughtful experience of actually being together, because what we're talking there is a whole discourse in arts management about immersive experiences and what immersive experience actually is.
And then there is interactive experience and in between of these two terms, there is just something that actually makes people involved and make them care about where they're going, the art form that they're seeing, be it a musical performance or theater, something that makes them an actor of the process, not, not just passive spectator. Right. Because still festivals are pretty passive activity. You just go there and you're staring at the stage, you're listening, you're vibing.
Jinghong Gong
Might be in the mosh pit. Depends on what kind of festival and music you're attracted to.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
People from who go to more niche festival are probably more involved because they have their own whole culture of how to interact.
Jinghong Gong
Yeah, and interact with the music.
Sofia Akhmanaeva:
Exactly. So, something to think about it here.
Jinghong Gong
I think you bring up a very good point, in terms of how festival can reinvent themselves for sure. I think because even, I didn't go to a lot of these festivals, South By was one of them. I think South By traditionally was just a music festival. It was just bands coming from, all over their country or world that gather together and play. But South By has reinvent themselves by bringing in a lot of corporate money. There's good and bad. But they definitely expand in their scale, and also bring in a lot of kind of being this, I would say a more career-oriented festival.
So a lot of people like me, who are students, who wants to get into this industry, we can go there and have all these different kinds of conference that we can actively interact with. However, of course, a lot of the other festivals are more entertainment oriented. It's just for serving the fans. What do they want to listen to and how can they interact with, the festival? I would say definitely music. It's not just booze, like not just passive spectating. I think music itself is still really powerful, like being blasted music, the subwoofers and how those vibration directly hits you in that scale at a festival, I think it's still quite irreplaceable.
The experience of live music is quite attractive. I still think to a lot of people if they were exposed to it, if the generation was exposed to it.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
No, I agree. Yeah, there could be a whole lot of alternative arguments here that like, well, if I have a normal sound system, I can just stay home and listen to everything in better quality.
But yeah, I'm on your side. Like, I like the physical experience of it, but I guess it just can just come again to the point of, okay, what exact music, and why would I like to go and pay that much money for specifically this lineup or like this collection of collection of artists.
Jinghong Gong
I think it's true because in one of our classes, like Managing Disruption, we talked about, you know, the idea of bundling. That's with, streaming platforms, but, traditionally I think all these festivals is a bundling service. They're trying to have as much music acts as possible at one place. You pay a flat fee going into this festival, and you don't need to go to every single artist. But they guarantee that they serve a wide genre of musical artists and you will have someone you like on that lineup. But I think that model is becoming more difficult, because the way people listen to music is slightly changed.
I think this space is still interesting to see how these festivals evolve, because a lot of them were canceling last year because of the high production cost and the risk that they need to put the upfront cost of, getting all these talents together, putting up the stage and basically setting up the whole thing.
And sometimes, if the ticket sales does not match the expectation, there's not much profit in it. And why would they do that? And also from the artist standpoint, a lot of them prefer just touring. Just going to do a national tour at live houses where they can capitalize off ticket sales and also merge selling and do different popup events gain more revenue from there. Compared to music festivals, if you're a smaller act, you basically play for free and sometimes you even pay to play at a festival just for exposure. So that model, I think more artists is more inclined to do their own thing, if that makes them more money. So that's something to think about.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
Yeah. It's interesting to see how all these trends that are sometimes contradictory will evolve. Artists need festivals, but audience is kind of skeptical now and festivals needs artists and audience, but it's not really profitable anymore.
Jinghong Gong
Yeah. Well, I definitely hope there's still more festival coming up.
I really like the experience. Bundling is a great, you know, economically it's a great invention. It was great. At least for me, at a festival, I get to see so many acts and I get to connect with so many people and find so many friends. Compared to just, you know, I go to one show and I only see a specific crowd. The charm is still there and definitely looking forward to see how the live industry responds to all these changes. yeah.
Well, it's been a pleasure talking to you, Sofia.
Sofia Akhmanaeva
Likewise, Jinghong.
Jinghong Gong
Thank you.